This is Why Women Are Afraid to Tell You No
This past Thursday, a group of men started cat-calling/hitting on a group of women in Chicago. When the women said, no, the men threw bottles and then SHOT at their car as they tried to drive away. One woman was shot in the shoulder, and the driver took a bottle in the head as she tried to drive off. Last month in Washington, DC a Transwoman was shot for turning down a man’s request for sex as she sat in her car. In August a woman in Atlanta was shot for refusing to get in a car with a group of men. In May of 2010 a young woman was shot in the leg for turning down a man’s advances.
Ok, so that was one googling, which also yielded an article on a woman in Australia who was shot in the thigh after refusing to perform oral sex. Many people will claim that these are just “isolated” incidents. But three of those took place in the last two, two and a half months. That’s not really isolated, in fact, that sounds distinctly like a pattern.
When guys complain about women not giving them a straight answer, this is why. Granted, these are fairly extreme. However, on a regular basis women who turn down men, no matter how nicely, are insulted, yelled at, spit on, hit, kicked and knocked to the ground. Most of these assaults go unreported because women know that the police aren’t going to take them seriously, particularly if they’re dressed at all nicely or “sexy.”
This is why the Schrodinger’s Rapist post resonated with so many women.
“Why are you afraid of women?” I asked a group of men.
“We’re afraid they’ll laugh at us,” replied the men.
“Why are you afraid of men?” I asked a group of women
“We’re afraid they’ll kill us,” replied the woman. –Margaret Atwood
When men ignore our boundaries, try to push or test them, we rightfully feel that they are a bigger risk for pushing even more important, dangerous boundaries, like say, raping or hitting you.
Yeah, I know, a lot of you are out there (if you’ve gotten this far) thinking, “That’s bullshit! I’d never do that!” And maybe you wouldn’t, but we can’t take that chance. And when you push boundaries or ignore our “No”s, even about small things, this puts you higher and higher up on the risk scale.
We can’t take those chances because when we’re raped or assaulted it’s always our fault. Everyone tells us so. Every single person who says, “I’d never blame the victim, but if you’re wearing a short skirt, what do you expect?” Every fucking magazine with their “Ten Things You Can Do to Not Be Raped” articles, that place all the onus on women, and none of it on, oh, the rapists.
How do you not scare women?
Respect their boundaries. Take no at face value. As a commenter said over on Pharyngula, you have nothing to lose: If she meant no, you’ve respected her wishes. If she meant “pursue me harder” or whatever bullshit, then bullet dodged. You don’t want to deal with that kind of mind-game playing, anyway.
But in all seriousness, guys, if you ever wonder why women act like their scared of you, read the above links again.
Polimicks 
This is completely accurate – as a woman assaulted by her ex-fiance – no did mean no, and so did the crying and all that but at some point yes I did give up – why because 5’5 130 pound woman versus hostile 6’3 280 pound man – I did the math and it wasn’t worth the fight then…
And that’s a scary thing to admit, that the survival instinct switches to not fighting in the face of violence, and that men are learning to be okay with this…
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Jenn–
Very scarily accurate on that last note you made.
No means no. Pouting about it isn’t cute, guilt-pushing is another form of not respecting boundaries.
If a someone, girls, and guys (who are plenty capable of getting raped too), says no to sex, just drop the subject. End of story.
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This is not a very convincing argument at all. “But three of those took place in the last two, two and a half months. That’s not really isolated, in fact, that sounds distinctly like a pattern.” 3 instances in different countries. A hand full of women mentioned in a world of approx 6.8 billion. I don’t see any statistically significant relevance or patterns in that. I’m not saying there isn’t an issue but this article is very anti male and very unfair. The Schrodinger’s Rapist post as quoted above shows women believe they are at risk but fear of something doesn’t mean it’s any more likely to happen, it’s not a fair comparison
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Reading comprehension fail: Three of those instances all took place in the US, in Chicago (US), Washington DC (US) and Atlanta (US). The fourth took place in Australia.
Now, count along with me. US plus Australia is how many countries?
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The shootings and assaults are the most extreme cases (and honestly, instances of retaliation against women who exercise their right to say ‘no’ are far more common than three cases, these are just, as she put it, from a quick googling)
The cases that almost ALL women are familiar with are, relative to those cases, mild. Harassment. Groping. Yelling. Insulting. Stalking. (seriously, ask a woman in your life. Pick a female friend/family member, and ask her if she’s had scary experiences with men on the street. There is no stronger way to get a sense of what women deal with just walking down the road)
I once was on a bus with a man who hit on me, and when I said no he blocked me off and wouldn’t let me get off the bus until I gave him my number (fake, of course). Another man followed me around the grocery store when I rejected him, and tried to follow me all the way home had I not found a cop car. Are these instances as extreme as getting shot in the leg? No. But far, far more commonplace. I’m not even going to list every rude comment, every casual disregarding of personal space, every subtly threatening or creepy gesture because those incidents are common and numerous and go all the way back to age 13 for me. Enough of those incidents happen, and it puts you on edge. It makes you nervous to say ‘no’ if you know what the response could be. And every time we say ‘no’ and it is ignored, either flirtatiously or threateningly, it lets us know: this guy doesn’t take my “no” seriously if it conflicts with what he wants.
Of course, I don’t think that’s most men. But even if 1% of guys are that kind of predatory douche, that 1% is loud and persistent enough to give men a bad name. THAT is why women give you nervous looks when you try to strike up a conversation, and THAT is why it’s very difficult to get a woman to trust you if you are a stranger in a public place. We get harassed so much we start to expect it. If you really are put out by how difficult it is to meet women in a public setting, don’t direct your anger at the women for trying to protect their safety, direct it at the men who create a climate of fear for them in public, thereby putting you at a disadvantage whenever you want to strike up a perfectly reasonable, respectful chat.
Those men are the true cock blocks, my friend.
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Dave,
Has a woman ever stalked you around a mall or any public place just because you were dressed nicely? Has a woman ever assaulted you just because you said no or rejected her advances politely? Has a woman ever come up behind you while you were at a party and forcibly bent you over, pulled your hair, groped you, and you couldt escape because they were hurting you? Have you ever been afraid of going out sometimes because you’re afraid some guy will harass you because that’s what happened the last few times? It’s absolutely terrifying. Men have done all these things to me and you cannot imagine the terror of knowing that someone who is bigger and stronger than you is following you or is forcing you into something. These events are not isolated. They are just the events that are reported. Most of these incidents happen regularly, but women don’t report them because we are repeatedly brushed off and told that we were asking for it or that the guy was just “persistent”. I myself carry around a tool of self defense as a direct result of these events and many other women carry around something that they think might help them.
This article by no means is anti-men it’s just bringing to light an ugly truth that many people just ignore and pretend isn’t a problem. Perhaps you are part of the problem as well if you believe this article is anti-men and that these are all isolated incidents.
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And this is why I, even as a male, gladly support any female who says they hate males, because I do too.
This is a gross display of how our society still considers women a lower class, like it can never be a man’s fault, it’s like some sort of stupid mutual defense mechanism to remove accountability for their actions and redirect the blame.
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I don’t hate men. And I don’t advocate hating men. I do advocate calling out assholes, regardless of gender. I don’t think you should ever hate anyone for something they can’t help (born a gender), but rather for things they can help, say, how they behave.
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Pingback: » This past Thursday, a group of men started cat-calling/hitting on a group of women in Chicago. When the women said, no, the men threw bottles and then SHOT at their car as they tried to drive away. One woman was shot in the shoulder, and t
Since this is a christian nation the men that treat women with violence have been raised in good christian homes where they believe that women should submit to men.
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@Ampelio….spoken like a true Godbot….although there are a good many religions that believe the same way and that is why I have a hard time with organized religion. It shouldn’t matter what religion, race, gender or whatever….NO MEANS NO MEANS NO MEANS NO!!! PERIOD END OF STORY!!
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Dave is most likely a rapist.
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Poor Dave! He didn’t at any point excuse the behavior described above. He didn’t at any point say these women deserved this treatment. All he did was think critically about information presented. This article does have a bias and does lack hard data collection, opinion polling, crime rates, or really any other academic evidence. I agree with the author and thought it was a well writing bit. Why is Dave a rapist just for questioning what he reads? The author makes good points and the author could have found more data to support those points. You know who is definitely a rapist? Those who have forced me and many other people to have sex with them. Dave does not deserve to be insulted so drastically for being the only one willing to say anything critical.
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…shame on you, Dave. Go vote for Mitt Romney
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Soooo its ok to be paranoid?
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Why do I get the sneaking suspicion that you’re the same kind of person who tells women they should have known better when they get raped, hurt or abducted?
Just a guess.
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It’s not paranoïa if they’re really out to get you and, believe EVERY SINGLE FEMALE above the age of 12 you can ask, they really REALLY are.
Think of it this way: you’re the guest of honour at someone’s mansion and you see someone lean on your super expensive luxury dream car. You tell them not to touch it and they tell you “why not? It’s such a gorgeous car, it deserves to be admired” and stroke the bonnet. Then, they inform you that they’re the mansion’s trusted valet and “not a bad guy, really!” (because what woman hasn’t hear that line?) you should give them the keys to go park your much-loved vehicle. They then loom over you with their much bigger, broader and heavier frame and smile “charmingly” in a completely “nonthreatening” manner.
You may reason with yourself “the parking lot is filmed and this guy will lose his job if he tries to drive off with my car. Besides, I know the plate number and I can call the cops if I need to!” but when it gets down to it, do you feel safe leaving your car with the valet? No. Do you check out the windows uneasily when you’re inside, wondering if your car was driven off and might be crashed into a tree at any moment? Yes. Do you feel as if the police won’t take you seriously and will blame and insult you if you call them and said “I gave this valet my keys and he stole my car”? Yes. Does this make you feel as if you WANT to say “yes” to the douche-bag valet groping your vehicle? NO!
If you’re the stereotypical “guy”, this analogy made lots of sense (I hope). Now, imagine that you’re female, the car in question is your body, your vagina, your right to feel safe… The valet is potentially every single male who approaches you. Do you feel safe taking your car/body out? Do you trust ANY valet/male you meet from the get-go? Are you paranoid? No. No and a very resounding NO.
There IS a threat; it’s not paranoia to be wary of it.
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